Irresponsible breeding....this really bugs me...

Discussion in 'Horse Chat' started by GotaDunQH, Jan 10, 2017.

  1. DancingArabian

    DancingArabian Senior Member

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    People can't handle responsible breeding of ourselves as a species, you think we will be better about it with another species?
     
  2. Alsosusieq2

    Alsosusieq2 Senior Member

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    [TE="DancingArabian, post: 8062661, member: 49344"]People can't handle responsible breeding of ourselves as a species, you think we will be better about it with another species?[/QUOTE]

    Got a point. Yes, I'd sure hope so.

    Dang this iPhone is bonkery.
     
  3. Kristal H

    Kristal H Senior Member

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    The Aranian Stallion was Czantiago and he is not a SCID, he is a CA carrier, and there were plenty of Arabian people who were not "blasé" over him being a CA carrier. The majority of Arabian breeders I know gelded their CA, SCID, LFS horses, and won't breed to a carrier stallion.
     
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  4. fennecfox

    fennecfox Senior Member

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    This is the greatest thing I've ever read.

    100 internets to you (y)
     
  5. BluemoonOKy

    BluemoonOKy Senior Member

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    Exactly.
    Yet, we see both on here even.
    Breeding genetic mutations is irresponsible as far as I'm concerned.
    Quote of the day. Perfect.
     
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  6. TallOak10

    TallOak10 Full Member

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    My peeve about this is a little bit in left field, but a real part of this problem nonetheless.

    Breeding happens, outcomes the baby, and either condition or color wise, it's less than what was desired. Then what? What's the level of responsibility to that animal?

    I know someone who had a beautiful palomino mare that was used for breeding for many years in spite of her genetic issues. ( I forget what issue she possessed and could potential he pass on to her young but I know that it was an issue for her owners, who bred her anyway. ) Well as fate would have it, eventually she passed on this issue to one of her fools. The couple broke up, majority of the horses sold off, and off once this little colt to a dealer, with his nuts in tact, and no information about his health status.

    So IF he's escaped the can, depending upon what his life is like, sooner or later, the stress of it will set him back.

    that's my issue about small operation breeding. What is the level of responsibility to that foal that either comes out with a genetic condition or an undesirable coat color?
     
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  7. Garfield70

    Garfield70 Senior Member

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    In my opinion, the stud should not only be free of genetic diseases but also be proven under saddle.

    Because what do you do with your "halter bred" horse when it's neither "good" enough for the big shows nor you can do anything else with it.

    Breeding "halter only" horses is irresponsible, be it Arabians, QHs or whatever.
     
  8. VermilionStrife

    VermilionStrife Senior Member

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    While I don't get the appeal of Halter only horses, some people prefer to do it that way and that's their decision.

    I do not support the decision to be breeding horses with genetic diseases. That isn't going to stop people from doing it. For those that insist on breeding horses with genetic diseases, it would be nice to have a rule that if a horse has a disease, even if it is recessive, they have to be gelded/spayed to prevent further reproducing. That will never happen, but it's nice to dream.
     
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  9. slc

    slc Senior Member

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    I think that when the breed organization condones and even encourages horses to be bred despite genetic defects, you're not going to get the rank and file to think any different. Why do they think that? Largely because it would take money out of their pockets.

    And look at the logic that supports it. There wouldn't be enough breeding animals if you excluded those animals. That argument was made earlier in the thread, I don't recall by who. Every generation, there would be fewer and fewer horses.

    Well, there's an oversupply now, but also, the number of horses in the breeding pool wouldn't drop that much, and wouldn't get smaller every year long term.

    Even if it did, getting a gene for something like HERDA or HYPP out of the breed - is worth it. These are horrific disorders. People are in denial about how horrific they really are. They've gotten used to it being there. It's become 'normal', like human obesity. We have proven, once again, that we can get to the point of thinking that almost anything - is 'normal', 'acceptable'. We already have a long history of living in a 'post fact world'. Getting HERDA and HYPP out of stock horse breeds would be a great way to start not living in a 'post fact world'.

    Once the breed organization stops registering animals that are heterozygous or homozygous for various simple gene traits unless they're neutered, and thus cuts them all out of the breeding herd, the gene will gradually go out of the gene pool.

    That's the only way to get rid of it.

    The only way.

    The horses that carry the gene aren't used for breeding. No horse can be registered without being tested. All having the gene to any level are neutered or spayed. They can be shown, but they can't be bred.

    It's that simple.

    Neither the breed organizations nor their members want to.

    Why?

    Money. But it's really all about biting the hand that feeds you.

    And in thinking that way, they'll ruin the stock horse breeds. Completely. For good. As the CEO of a big company once said, "No one is irreplaceable". The stock horse breeds - the organizations and their members - don't get that. They think they're here forever.

    In general, horse breeds don't exist for a long time. Look at a book from 1850, and look at what breeds it lists.

    This is why that happens.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
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  10. sherian

    sherian Senior Member

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    \sorry Kristal H, I probably should learn not to comment when the brain is fried by board meetings - didn't mean to imply all Arab people - should have said the Arab breeders who were on the forum were blase about it, very much "it's ok just test and warmblood mares won't be carriers anyways". Not sure if they specialised in breeding 1/2 arab sport horses but it is a sport horse breeders forum.
    I do agree with SLC - when its allowed, and the negative effect is not personal things do "normalise" and its harder to see the problem.
     

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