How long after worming...

Discussion in 'Horse Health' started by touchofdandy, Mar 28, 2010.

  1. touchofdandy

    touchofdandy Senior Member+

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    How long (i know this will vary somewhat from horse to horse) would it take to start seeing improvement after using the panacure power pack or the double dosing of safeguard for 5 days?

    Thanks:)
     






  2. JBandRio

    JBandRio Senior Member+

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    Depends on what issues were being caused by the parasites. Improved appetite can start pretty quickly, weight gain can start quickly if he's enough underweight, etc. Within a few weeks.
     
  3. touchofdandy

    touchofdandy Senior Member+

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    Appetite has always been good.

    His 3 main issues, underweight, rough coat, hardly any growth.

    I kept him up to date on worming but just now found out how I can worm him and yet not get the small strongyles. I think that is our problem, given all the info I have read on that.

    Thanks!
     
  4. ejforrest

    ejforrest Senior Member+

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    If you are "up to date" on deworming and he still has signs of parasites, sounds like your current deworming program is no longer working. Many parasites have become resistant to many dewormers.

    Resistant Worms: Do Your Horses Have Them?
    www.thehorse.com/printarticle.aspx?ID+=2305

    Most people assume that when they administer a tube of dewormer to a horse, the drug is effectively killing worms. The drug must work--it says so there on the label. Right? Unfortunately, the answer frequently is no. All dewormers were highly effective when they were first introduced, but over time parasites have developed resistance to many drugs. The product labels reflect results of studies performed when the dewormers were first developed--before the worms developed resistance--and drug companies have not been required by the FDA to modify labels to reflect current levels of effectiveness. So it's possible that the drug you choose to deworm your horses might not be doing what you expect.

    The practice of rotation (using a different class of deworming drug each time you treat your horse) is also an idea whose time has come and gone. It does not appear to significantly slow the progression of resistance, and it can actually mask the clinical effects of using an ineffective drug along with an effective one. As a result, horse owners, stable managers, and veterinarians are almost always unaware of the drug resistance problem.

    "The prevalence and levels of resistance to fenbendazole, oxibendazole, and pyrantel pamoate found in this stufy were far greater than in any previously published report."

    If a treated horse is infected with worms resistant to that drug, he will shed resistant eggs for several weeks following treatment. Furthermore, unless he is treated with a drug that kills the mucosal larval stages encysted in the intestinal wall (which are often much more numerous than the adult worms in the lumen of the gut), over the following weeks the mucosal larval worms will emerge from the intestinal wall and mature into adults, so a new round of egg shedding will occur. All of these eggs will come from the population of worms carried by the horse to its new location, so any drug-resistant worms infecting that horse will rapidly contaminate the new environment with drug-resistant infective larvae.

    We need to be proactive about the problem and let go of outdated approaches. Using drugs that don't work because of resistance is both ineffective and a waste of money.

    BY KAREN BRIGGS, WITH CRAIG REINEMEYER, DVM, PHD; DENNIS FRENCH, DVM, MS, DIPL. ABVP;
    AND RAY KAPLAN, DVM, PHD
     
  5. meadow36

    meadow36 Senior Member+

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    touchofdandy,

    I can sympathize - my boy has the same issues; he came to me absolutely loaded with worms and despite my efforts his fecals are still coming up positive.

    I am going to be starting Strongid C feed through wormer next week, as per the recommendations of several vets at school.

    Hang in there!

    Oh - forgot to mention - I power packed my horse, and he started dropping weight a week later (which at the time I thought was normal - his body "purging" so to speak). However, he never quite rebounded and didn't put the weight back on. The reason is because the adult strongyles are 90% resistant to fenbendazole, and since I didn't have that population under control, the power pack wasn't as effective (since it's main use is to act on stage 3 larval encysted strongyles). So, my plan is to start the feed through wormer, back it up with a dose of moxidectin, then power pack again several months from now.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2010
  6. JBandRio

    JBandRio Senior Member+

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    You should see some weight gain within a few weeks. Keep putting a weight tape on him every week or two :)

    I think you mean encysted strongyles ;)

    What have you been worming him with, and when?
     
  7. touchofdandy

    touchofdandy Senior Member+

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    yes thats what i meant, just couldn't think of the proper name :wink:

    From the time I got him at 4mos up to now (2yrs in May) He has had safeguard (1x when I first got him), ivermectin, equimax and quest plus.

    As for when I have wormed him. I could only tell you the last few times, past that I dont have the old calendars.
    Last time he was wormed with quest plus. That was in Jan but that was after worming with Ivermectin in December. I didn't see a change in him from the beginning of December to middle of Jan. So I tried another wormer to see if that would work. He was wormed prior to that with equimax when it was still warm.

    My mini went through this with the whole weight issue....I double dosed the safeguard for 5 days, as recommended by a miniature horse breeder, and it worked with her. She turned around and started looking better and better. That was in Jan. So I thought perhaps the same thing was going on with my colt. :confused:

    Thanks:)
     
  8. JBandRio

    JBandRio Senior Member+

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    If he never got double-dosed with Safeguard or Panacur, then he may very well have a large load of ascarids. They have a high resistance issue now to ivermectin and moxidectin.

    Know that Equimax and Quest Plus both contain praziquantel, which gets tapeworms, and there's no need to use that more than twice a year - right around the last/first frost times.

    Entirely possible. It won't hurt. However, the Quest Plus would have done almost the same thing, getting all but one stage of the encysted strongyles. It's probably more likely at this point it's an ascarid problem.
     
  9. touchofdandy

    touchofdandy Senior Member+

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    If he never got double-dosed with Safeguard or Panacur, then he may very well have a large load of ascarids. They have a high resistance issue now to ivermectin and moxidectin.
    Do the ascarids cause weight, coat, and growth problems?

    Know that Equimax and Quest Plus both contain praziquantel, which gets tapeworms, and there's no need to use that more than twice a year - right around the last/first frost times.


    Entirely possible. It won't hurt. However, the Quest Plus would have done almost the same thing, getting all but one stage of the encysted strongyles. It's probably more likely at this point it's an ascarid problem.



    Thanks! :)
     
  10. JBandRio

    JBandRio Senior Member+

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    Absolutely ascarids can cause those problems. Pretty easily too.

    Welcome :)
     






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