1. JOIN the world's largest horse forum! Chat and learn from other experts about horse training, breeding, health, showing, riding, contests and use our free horse classifieds. Register Here

Featured Good rebuttal to Last Chance Corral's "shame of the TB industry" nursemare foals.

Discussion in 'Horse Rescue / Adoption' started by meljean, Oct 10, 2016.

  1. CoffeeBean

    CoffeeBean Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2012
    Messages:
    4,332
    Likes Received:
    7,440
    I found this elsewhere on the net and figured I'd copy and paste it. AHA permits AI.

     
  2. Alsosusieq2

    Alsosusieq2 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2016
    Messages:
    7,496
    Likes Received:
    5,654
    That's my take also. Sorry, but it's big friggin business for them.
     
  3. slc

    slc Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    15,408
    Likes Received:
    9,050
    I think of it differently. I think it's mostly tradition. People make far LESS money doing live cover using non-extended semen. Boarding a few live cover mares is a lot less money and a lot more risk and overhead than AI. You eliminate a lot of customers by distance from the mare.

    And I don't think the AI market would hurt the elite race horse market at all.

    Why? Well....when I got on the waiting list for semen from...one of the best dressage breeding stallions ever, ALL I did was get on a waiting list. The semen will go to the elite customers first. I probably won't ever get off the waiting list.

    That's the other thing about AI. AI doesn't extend astronomically, how many mares you can breed. There still are limitations. The stallion semen quality period of each year, the extent to which the semen can be extended, and so on.

    Further, many mares will still need live cover. AI with chilled, and even more so, frozen, isn't for every mare. So AI would really extend the market, rather than get rid of the old way of doing things. Instead, it's really more about adding more business.

    With the way things are, I think many of the AI breedings would go to horses that people have no intention of racing. The number of race horses in the US can't ramp up quickly.

    A lot of the breedings would be going to people in the hunter, eventing and pleasure horse and show ring business. Little hunter ponies (half welsh), show hunters, lower level dressage horses, and so on.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2016
  4. Kristal H

    Kristal H Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    1,086
    Likes Received:
    2,003


    If we look at this scientific or mathematicly with live coverage one ejaculation covers 1 mare, With AI it can be separated and extended to cover 4-6 mares. The stallion can be collected out of prime breeding season and frozen to make more semen available during prime breeding season ( Feb and March for TB's). Pleaures horses are often bred the in April, May, June. A stallion can breed more mares

    The mare owner pays for the transport, board or AI cost..... It cost less on average to Inseminate than it cost to ship,a mare across the country. The boarding and foaling of mares is a huge income for the TB farms. If the TB farm loses the board/foalimg money and it would decentralize the TB Industry as mares can be bred anywhere and stallions can stand anywhere. It would no-longer require the horses to be in the same geographical area.

    Arabians have done AI and ET for decades..... I believe it has helped to improve the quality of the stock. Arabian breeders responded quickly to the drop of the horse market, as most intelligent breeders realized it did not make sense to spend $1000s to produce horses that could not be sold for their breeding cost. After years of very limited and select breeding, We are now starting to see a improved market for Arabian horses. We are also seeing very good quality..... Hopefully we will see fewer cull horses and a higher percentage that will do what they were bred for, and have the longevity to be useful for a longer time.
     
    CoffeeBean, Varisha and slc like this.
  5. meljean

    meljean Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    Messages:
    12,589
    Likes Received:
    22,687
    All AI and ET has done, is to add more horses to the mix, and in the case where an owner had used shipped semen that was all shipped for one mare due to her 'not taking'' but actually bred 7 foals from it, there are 6 grade horses, the vet who owned stallion may have taken them for breach of contract, can't remember right now, but fees will be high for having to register them this late.

    Few other states are going to get into racing to the extent that it requires to be successful.
     
    D_BaldStockings and slc like this.
  6. slc

    slc Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    15,408
    Likes Received:
    9,050
    great points, thanks for the discussion.
     
  7. Kristal H

    Kristal H Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    1,086
    Likes Received:
    2,003
    Statistics from breed that support AI and ET do. It support this... it does show that fewer employees stallions are used. The math never lies.
     
  8. Alsosusieq2

    Alsosusieq2 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2016
    Messages:
    7,496
    Likes Received:
    5,654

    ^^ yes. I agree completely but I also understand the reluctance. We're dealing with racing and a lot of money on the line. When were talking about huge amounts of money for studs and for the opportunity to have a stake in the race business there's a tremendous push for illegal activity in breeding. Obviously there's genetic testing now so perhaps it's a moot issue. I say yes to AI myself but I don't live in Kentucky.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2016
  9. Kristal H

    Kristal H Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    1,086
    Likes Received:
    2,003
    Registries that allow off site AI usually require DNA, shipped semen permit signed by stallion owner, and a stallion report from stallion owner. If all these things are not in place you can't register the foal. Non registered foals can't compete in their breed. Fraudulently creating these documents will not only get one banned from the registry it is criminal and registries will persue.

    If a stallion contract is written well using semen on a different mare other than on the contract is theft and criminal, and set you up for a civil lawsuit.

    Only an idiot would steal semen, and the resulting foals are considered grade.
     
  10. BluemoonOKy

    BluemoonOKy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2013
    Messages:
    6,793
    Likes Received:
    11,899
    I agree we need to get rid of AI. I do live in Kentucky and you can come get semi trucks full of free horses. Not just grade either. We don't need more horses flooding the industry. And, we don't need more states getting into racing, either.
     

Share This Page